Tony Furnivall wrote:
>
> Roy's hypothetical goes right to the heart of the issue...
>
> At 05:00 PM 3/23/99 -0800, Roy Buzdor wrote:
> >
> >Question...if I purchased a 9000, and a version of
> >MPE/ix sized for 20 users,
>
> ... I don't know that you can "buy" MPE without the
> hardware, so we may have a problem right up front,
> but let's stipulate this...
I thought that it would be possible to buy it from
someone who is dispatching an old 917 in favor of
a new AS/400. (;
> >Then I delved into the MPE/iX system
> >and changed the 20 into a 200.
>
> ...this is probably the first of the egregious
> violations of the license for the software ...
If I bought a copy of MPE/iX second hand, do I
own it or is it still an extended "lease"?
> >If I then sold that
> >system as a mutated system, would I be violating any
> >legalities,
>
> ...of course you would. You would probably be on less
> shaky ground if you provided all the disclaimers (.ie
> provided the complete "maintenance history" of the box,
> just as you would for a car, or a plane or a boat), but
> I guess at that point you'd be proclaiming your
> intention to violate the license, and thus render
> yourself liable to civil penalties. My guess is that
> attempting to sell the box as an HP3000 would render
> you liable for criminal penalties as well.
I guess I was thinking of the old paradigm, where you
actually owned whatever you bought, and as such, it
was yours to do with as you choose, and sell as you
choose. I could understand the whole reverse engineering
thing if I were to hack MPE/iX change the copyright
and other key items, and then sell multiple copies of
it as BUZ/iX or some such thing. However, if I bought
a copy of MPE/iX 20 user for every MPE/iX 200 user
that I sold, in my simple mind, it would be like
buying a Camero, upgrading the engine to the same as a
Formula Firebird, adding all the fancy detailing to
match a Formula Firebird, and then selling it at an
increased price (but still cheaper than a Formula
Firebird) as a "Formula" Camero. While GM might not
like the competition, as far as I know, that is not
illegal, as long as I let the buyer know that it is
actually a customized Camero, not a Firebird.
> >using parts which I perchased,
>
> .. would it have made any difference if you'd stolen
> or been given these parts, I think not!
Yes it would, if they were available to purchase, then
I would have broken no laws in obtaining them, nor would
there be any restrictions to what end I used them...I
could tie a rope to them and used them as an anchor.
> >and I did not use any unauthorized
> >software to change the values in the OS?
>
> ... the issue is the reverse engineering itself, not
> how you accomplish it!
I'm sorry, I thought that part of the offense was the
fact that the alleged criminals were in possession and
did use specialized software to which they had no
authority to have access to. If I have a copy of
Microsoft Excel +2, which is unavailable to the public,
then I must have stolen it, or have been given an
illicit copy of it. But, if I know what it does, I sit
down and a program which can manipulate *.xl2 files,
then I have come up with a value-add product on my own.
> >i.e. was the
> >criminal action by these other companies the fact that
> >they (1) used unauthorized software, (2) bribed people
> >inside HP to give them inside information, (3) got
> >upgrade kits (funny, a 9000 to a 3000 is an UPGRADE)
> >under the table, or (4) that they were selling 3000s
> >for a price that HP should have been selling them for?
>
> While I will take second place to no-one in my attempts
> to persuade HP that they can improve the way they do
> business with their customers (and I think I have a
> pretty fair track-record on this), I think that to
> apply this sort of reasoning to their pricing policies
> and product definition practices is futile. it amounts
> to standing in the face of a hurricane shortly after
> ingesting a large quantity of beer, or other diuretic
> substances!
Or, perhaps, a bit like attacking a windmill?
--
Buz (8
+--------------------------------------------------------------+
| Knowledge is proud that it has learn'd so much; |
| Wisdom is humble that it knows no more. |
| -- William Cooper: _The Task VI_ |
+---------------------------------------+----------------------+
| This is official written notice: | My real address is: |
| Please remove me from your mailing | lnuslad dot dzvg41 |
| list. | at eds dot com |
+---------------------------------------+----------------------+
|
