All good points and questions.  And it is difficult to determine the
fine line between saving a child from harm, or creating harm.  But when
we're talking about close to 500 kids at once, I do think a bit of
common sense should have prevailed.

Again, we guard the kids at the compound (much cheaper then paying to
relocate them to foster care) until we deem that the kids are safe (even
if it means removing the adult males for the time being), educate the
entire tribe/group about the laws regarding sex with minors, remove and
punish the perpetrators, and then let the parents raise their kids. 

Recall that many of these folks have been 'raised to religiously believe
in what they are doing', so we owe it to the families and ourselves to
help educate them about right and wrong.  Without education, we are not
really dealing with the problem - it'll remain, and in this case, we're
screwing up almost 500 kids' lives.



-----Original Message-----
From: HP-3000 Systems Discussion [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On
Behalf Of Paul Scott
Sent: Thursday, April 24, 2008 3:49 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [HP3000-L] OT: A sad event for Texas and the U.S.

Having adopted 2 children, I have a very interesting view of parental
rights/responsibilities. To become a parent, I had to fill out
applications, have my taxes reviewed, have criminal background checks
run, have my home inspected not once but twice per child (not because
anything was found... once before you can receive the child and once
after just in case you setup a sweat-shop and have them assembling
sneakers for 19 cents/day). I had to fill out forms of what birth
defects were acceptable to me, what nationalities and mixes of
nationalities were acceptable. I had to write essay answers to question
regarding would I spank a child "ever". What was my childhood like. How
do I view religion in terms of raising a child. All the while wondering,
"Am I answering this the way THEY want me to?"

Now my brother-in-law on the other hand has a criminal background, has
no idea how to educate his children, and hasn't even taught them to
brush their teeth. He keeps breeding trying to gain the approval of his
father, which ironically, he won't get until he starts actually
parenting his children. And I would characterize some of what he has
done criminally negligent.

Although I'm rarely in favor of governmental interference in our lives,
this so reminds me of the scene in the movie Parenthood where Keanu
Reeves character has a moment of clarity and says, "... you need a
license to buy a dog, to drive a car - hell, you even need a license to
catch a fish. But they'll let any butt-reaming asshole be a father."

So is it our inalienable right to mess up the next generation if we want
to or should someone step in? And at what point should someone step in?
I certainly don't have any answers here.


Paul 

-----Original Message-----
From: HP-3000 Systems Discussion [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On
Behalf Of Craig Lalley
Sent: Thursday, April 24, 2008 12:20 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [HP3000-L] OT: A sad event for Texas and the U.S.

"Johnson, Ted" <[log in to unmask]> wrote:    
Wow, aren't we all a morbid bunch today.


  As a father of five children it gives me no comfort to know that they
can be taken at anytime, as the result of an anonymous phone call.
  
When DCFS or what ever it is called in your state, is notified, you are
guilty until proven inocent.   
   
  This is not a new phenomon, there are stories all over the internet,
here's one:
  http://conservablogs.com/muthstruths/2007/12/02/441/
   
  -Craig
   


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