Hi

I've got involved in these discussions before with Deny's.  Before we even
started I assumed (wrongly) that everyone accepted that Hitler was 'right
wing'.

The only definition I can find from is the following Britannica Concise
Encyclopaedia, which links Neofacism with the term 'Right Wing', which
contradicts Deny's viewpoint:

political philosophy and movement that arose in the post-World War II era
and, like earlier fascist movements, advocated extreme nationalism and
authoritarianism, opposed the liberal individualism of the Enlightenment,
attacked Marxist and other left-wing ideologies, indulged in racist and
xenophobic scapegoating, posed as a protector of traditional national
culture and religion, glorified violence, and promoted populist right-wing
economic programs.

Unlike earlier fascists, however, neofascists placed more blame for their
countries' problems on non-European immigrants than on leftists and Jews,
displayed little interest in taking lebensraum (German: "living space")
through the military conquest of other states, and made concerted efforts to
portray themselves as democratic and "mainstream." Among European movements
and parties considered by many to be neofascist: in Italy, the National
Alliance (formerly the Italian Social Movement), led by Gianfranco Fini; in
Germany, the Republicans, led by former Waffen-SS member Franz Schönhuber;
in France, the National Front, led by Jean-Marie Le Pen; in Russia, the
Liberal-Democratic Party, led by Vladimir Zhirinovsky; the Serbian Radical
Party, led by Vojislav Seselj; and the Croatian Party of Rights, led by
Dobroslav Paraga. Neofascist organizations outside Europe include the regime
of Juan Perón in Argentina (1946-55; 1973-74); the White Workers Party
(formerly the South African Gentile National Socialist Movement) in South
Africa; and the regimes of Muammar al-Qaddafi in Libya and Saddam Hussein in
Iraq.

http://search.britannica.com/ebc/article?eu=409628&query=right%20wing&ct=gen
1



-----Original Message-----
From: Denys Beauchemin [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: 16 February 2003 23:38
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [HP3000-L] Terry Jones (from Monty Python) on War


Sorry to disagree but Hitler was the quintessential Socialist.  It just so
happens that most Socialists are also fascists because the two tendencies
are closely related.  The Socialist/fascist wants everyone to do the same
thing, to think the same way and to depend on the state for everything.  The
Socialist/fascist does not believe an individual is intelligent enough or
wise enough to make his or her own decisions about anything of importance.
The government must get bigger and bigger and be all-encompassing.  The
conservative or right-winger or Libertarian, take your pick, wants a small
government and wants the freedom to decide for him or herself.  Rugged
individualism.

Perhaps it might help you if we classify the
Socialists/fascists/Communists/Nazis simply as Statists.  Actually one of
the reasons the Socialists support Iraq (witness the large leftist
pro-Saddam demonstrations this weekend,) is that Socialists never met a
dictator they didn't like, with the possible exception of Augusto Pinochet
(who fought the communist insurgents and willingly walked away from power,
bloodlessly,) and Slobo Milosovich who was defending against an Islamic
invasion.  (I read what you wrote about him and while it may all be true, I
just have never heard of any mass graves actually found.  I am not saying
there aren't any, I just haven't heard about it.  Whilst I think Slobo is a
rotten individual and deserves whatever happens to him, compared to Saddam,
he's a piker.  I have read in several places where they were having
difficulties coming up with evidence to back the charges against him.  I am
surprised that after 3-4 years on the ground in Kosovo and the surrounding
areas, he has still not been convicted.  Surely after this time, we should
have the damning information needed to convict him.)

Some have opined that fundamental Islam, Wahabisim (sp), is very much a form
of Fascism, whereby one cannot question authority and all good things are
reserved only for the privileged few, the leadership and their minions.
Some have said this sounds very socialistic.

I would venture to say the most virulent anti-Semitism is found in
socialist/statist regimes and this is true to this day.  And just because
one is a statist country does not mean one doesn't go to war against another
statist country.  Remember that in the late 1930's the Soviet Union was
closely allied with Nazi Germany, they did Poland together.  They are the
ones who helped Hitler rearm in secret and were even supplying him with raw
materials up to and into the beginning of operation Barbarossa in 1941.
Indeed advancing Nazi Armies were meeting incoming trains full of raw
material sent from Stalin to Hitler.  There was also a large communist
element in the US, Canada and England that was working to try to prevent
people from viewing Hitler as a bad person.  After September 1939, they
redoubled their efforts in the USA to make sure America would not go to war
against Hitler.  It was only after Hitler, the National Socialist, attacked
Communist Russia that these communists changed their tune and starting
demanding that America go to war against Hitler and support Uncle Stalin.

Remember the USSR and China, China and Viet Nam.  Sharks have no problems
attacking each other.


Denys

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