On Thu, 11 Oct 2001 20:49:40 -0500, Mike Wallace <[log in to unmask]>
wrote:

>On 11 Oct 2001, at 4:56, Krazy Kiwi wrote:
>
>> >On 8 Oct 2001, at 5:28, Krazy Kiwi wrote:
>> >> What about the other side of the coin ... the physical
>> >> condition of that diver?
>>
>> Mike Wallace wrote:
>> >>Mean exactly zip on this side of the pond. If you can inhale and
>> >>exhale on a somewhat repetitive basis you can get certified here.
>>
>> If a diver with a medical problem that could be life threatening
>> manages to lie his way through his original physical examination
>> with the Dr. for OW you have a ticking timebomb if he manages to
>> survive long enough to get to rebreather level.

I think you've both put your fingers on the right spots!  But the
truth still lies somewhere in between.  :-)   We can continue the
finger-wrestling (or body-wrestling to toughen your physical
conditions <BWG>) when you two meet at da Feeesh Aquarium next year!

I agree with Mike.  People lie about their physical conditions.  Some
are valid and harmless (I'll give examples) and some are not.

I agree with Viv, in the sense that if someone who is not physically
fit and DOES NOT KNOW that his/her physical condition could lead to
life-threatening conditions beyond HIS/HER control, then said person
is a ticking time-bomb or a disaster waiting to happen.

What about the TRUTH in between?

Glad you asked.  :-)

Take diabetes -- please. (In the voice of Henny Youngman :-).  It USED
to be an "absolute contraindication" to scuba, period, even for the
Type II (and non-insulant-dependent ones) that can be easily controlled
(for most) under daily oral medication.

That's me.  My Type II diabetes was well under control long before I
started scuba.  I was fully aware of the POTENTIAL danger, and I was
also fully aware of the absence of any dangerous symptoms/effects in
my physical activities resulting from it.

I DON'T recall whether I lied or not about it when I got my OW cert.
I DO remember lying about it on the Peter Hughes liveaboard form (of
early years) when telling the truth would have required a statement
from a physical that NO physical would be willing to make!

Diabetes IS NO LONGER an ABSOLUTE contraindication (not even the
insulant-dependent Type I).  Neither are many other FORMER contra-
indications.  In a joint communicade, published in DAN's Alert Diver,
some years ago, the medical profession behind SCUBA has agreed that
these must be treated on a CASE BY CASE basis -- between the diver
and his/her phsician.

NOW there is no longer any reason for me to lie about my diabetes --
in other words, I was ahead of the times of Scuba professionals!  :-)
Now I freely put down that condition and the medication I take (when
asked on the liveaboard forms), and everyone is happen about knowing
the "truth", in my case.  :)

There are other medical conditions (which I don't have) that are quite
thoroughly discussed in Alert Diver and other scuba magazines to make
the informed aware of the dangers and importance of medical supervision
and treatment in those cases, but specialists and MDs, not DMs and
those who play MD on TV or scuba groups.  :-)

In the end, the same old RULE holds:

Know YOUR limit ...         :-)   Self-responsibility rules, again!

>
>I think we might all be surprised to know just how many have lied on
>their medical forms.

Not surprised at all, to me, especially if some forms use the solicited
information in a manner that is not to the best interest of EITHER party.

>In the US, a diver does not HAVE to get a
>physical exam before beginning dive training. They just have to
>complete a medical questionaire. If they lie, we have no way of
>knowing until something happens. If they do answer a question
>indicating a potential problem, we can then require them to get an
>exam before beginning training.

The latter would be the proper thing to advise and REQUIRE.  But if
the approach was like the good old days of just saying "You CAN'T
because you have an 'absolute contraindication'", or something like
that, then there is a great propensity fot he subject to choose to
lie, rightly or wrongly.

>~~~~~~~~~~
>Mike Wallace
>Huntsville, Alabama

-- Bob.