Hello Christian,

I think some of the "buy local" campaign here comes from the miserable job the US law makers (politicians) have done in positioning US companies to succeed selling US manufactured goods and services against non-US goods in the US market place (as well as the world markets) and the number of US industries that have shutdown as a result.

Some of the benefit cost to employers of US manufactured products:

1. Employer paid portion of Social Security.
2. Employer paid Workman's unemployment compensation.
3. Employer contribution to retirement / pension.
4. Employer contribution to healthcare (+2010 added enhanced healthcare).
5. Other?

All of this cost is added to the purchase price of a US manufactured product that is sold in the US or exported that most often is not included in products imported to the US.

It is pretty easy to see how China can sell goods so cheap at Wal-Mart (as an example) when the cost to ship the goods over the water is *so* much less than the cost of these US employee benefits (employer cost); not even taking into consideration the direct labor cost and currency differential.

Many US companies move their manufacturing off shore, because under the US tax laws and the weight of US labor unions it is the obvious solution.  One could call this corporate greed; another could call it stupid politicians for supporting and promoting this behavior through dated laws which do not take into consideration the import and export of goods sold in the world markets.

IMHO: It would be a huge benefit to promote US jobs by taking some of the above noted US Employer cost and moving it to a sales tax on "all" products purchased (not just US manufactured goods as is much of the case today).  

Another big change would be to revamp the US corporate/business tax system, specifically reducing or increasing corporate taxes paid based on the number of US employees hired as a percentage of profits.

The US just added to the cost of US manufactured product and services a very expensive health-care program.  It is my expectation that this plan will not have a positive impact on US job creation in the short and long run.  This socioeconomic experiment is something we will see play out in this decade; meanwhile I am trying to figure out how I can off-shore or outsource my retirement account...

Peace,
  James Hofmeister

P.S. My Ideals are my own; definitely not my employers and no one else would have them.







-----Original Message-----
From: OpenMPE Support Group [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Christian Lheureux
Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2010 11:21 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [OPENMPE] OT: Re: Global Economics ( was Hp 3000 MPE-IX Trainner)

The upside of buying local is that you spare the planet a few kilos/tons/whatever of greenhouse gases. That's a small contribution to enhancing our collective future. Apart of that, I would tend to agree with Mark, I fail to see where buying local makes full sense.

Let's forget the hypocrisy. Open the trunk of an American, or French, or German, or any other car. How many parts are fully made in the USA, France, Germany, respectively ? 5%? 10% ? It's even worse with computers. Try to identify the components of a so called American HP server : the R&D is shared between the States, India and a few other countries (perhaps incidentally including mine, France). The metal frame may be US or Canadian made (I honestly have no clue). Chips may be made in Taiwan, ROC (another good dose of hyprocrisy, there, Taiwan ROC .....), China PRC, Indonesia, Malaysia. The hard disk is made in Singapore or the Philippines, with components from  at least 10 other countries ...

It's a world economy. It's here. No need to waste much time on buying local. Too late.

My € 0,02. Just that.

Christian, somewhere in France, with US vacation plans next summer.


-----Message d'origine-----
De : OpenMPE Support Group [mailto:[log in to unmask]] De la part de Mark Wonsil
Envoyé : mardi 30 mars 2010 04:59
À : [log in to unmask]
Objet : Re: OT: Re: Global Economics ( was Hp 3000 MPE-IX Trainner)


OK, I'm going to be the unpopular guy.

To me anyway, this is an issue of perception. When it's my job that
feels the heat of competition, well, competition sucks. When I'm the
one replacing someone else's job, then competition is great. Big Iron
people complained when the mini-computer came out and started eating
their lunch. We were cheaper than those guys and we were more
versatile. And when PCs came to the business workplace, it turned the
screws even tighter on the slow-moving data center. A lot of CICS
programmers lost their jobs.  I mean, holy [log in to unmask] If you bought Turbo
Pascal for $39, you were putting those expensive compiler programmers
out of work. Should we have blocked the mini or micro computer or
Borland to save those high paying jobs? Would that have made this a
better world? The answer generally depends on your point of view now,
doesn't it?

As for only buying local, that's just something I don't get. I often
hear on the radio that we should buy local to support our local
economy. It sounds good and at first blush and it really seems to make
sense at some level. On further reflection, it's really just an
emotional appeal and not necessarily a thoughtful philosophy.

Let's say that there are two products of the same quality but the
local one cost $10 more. I feel patriotic and buy the local one and
support my local economy. Yay! Wait a minute. I have ten dollars less
to spend. I could have supported another local business if I had
bought the less expensive item. There's an unseen victim. Here in
Detroit, I often heard, "If people don't spend the extra $2K to buy
'American' cars, who's going to buy all of those big screen TVs?"
Well, everyone who buys a cheaper car can now afford one!

Also, if I only buy local, wouldn't I be hypocritical if I didn't only
sell local as well? I mean, the other cities/states/countries should
only be buying local too and not from me. I should make my living on
just those around me. Sure, that will reduce the economies of volume
and I'll have to charge more but that would be the patriotic thing to
do. No?

I feel badly for those whose jobs are no longer needed. It's very
personal and extremely frustrating. Some will move on to greener
pastures and actually become grateful for the change while others
never get beyond the pain and anger.

From a completely humanitarian point of view, the gentlemen from India
are trying to take care of their families just as we ours. I cannot
blame them for that. I also understand the hurt of those who lost
their jobs and will have trouble supporting their family. But it's
quite possible that when everyone buys the more expensive local
option, they may very well be killing their own next job.

Just some food for thought.

<taking_cover />

Mark W.