(I changed the subject line.)

I do not see the problem.  The table in the first link compares PalmOS,
Windows CE and EPOC.  The second link discusses how the Compaq iPAQ has
displaced the Palm.  It does not talk about how Pocket PC has displaced
Palm, as I said, it compares two companies  (Compaq and Palm.)  The third
link has two tables.  The first one compares hardware:  Palm, Compaq, Psion,
Handspring, HP and others.  The second table compares operating systems:
Windows CE, PalmOS, EPOC and others.

The rest of your message is excellent.  I am sure that you are correct when
it comes to prices.  About the only thing I would caution you is to make
sure you compare the capabilities.  I can do things with a Pocket PC that
you could never do with a Palm.  Further, as you state, the Pocket PC device
is more powerful and has more storage than a Palm device.  Does it need more
power and storage?  Obviously.

On my iPAQ ($500), I have installed a PC-card adapter ($150) and I have a
Sierra Wireless AirCard 300 PC-card ($300).  This gives me always on CDPD
access at 19.2Kbaud.  Now, I don't know about the cell phone plan you have
but the ones that are available to me in Texas are all limited in terms of
minutes per month.  We are looking at 100 minutes (1.666 hour) for $30 to
2000 minutes (33.3 hours) for $200.  I will bust the upper limit in a single
out of town trip if I had to use that to get Internet access.  My setup
costs $40/month for unlimited usage.  Clearly the methodology I employ is
much superior to the one you chose, cheaper and faster.   At current rates
and my usage patterns, in one or two months, I have saved enough money to
pay for the difference in initial costs.  After two months, your methodology
is costing me big time.  Now, if you do not travel much or if you do not
need wireless Internet access as much as I do, then your method is very
usable.  Perhaps you might want to see if it is possible to have CDPD access
on a Palm or Visor.  I am sure that should be possible, as I understand
there is now a CF-card format CDPD card.

For wireless voice, I have another device called a cell phone.  It has its
own battery and its own headset.  Mine is an older one, but it can have a
small organizer on it.  I have the organizer, but I do not use it anymore.
It's a pain.

(I am now looking for a new cell phone with Bluetooth technology.  Yes, the
Pocket PC has Bluetooth capabilities, given the device and I can also have
it in the laptop, simply by adding a PC-card.  So far, I have found 3 phones
that have Bluetooth:  the Motorola Timeport 290, the Ericsson T-28 and the
Nokia 6210.  The Moto has it built-in and it is CDMA.  The Ericsson needs an
additional module and is GSM.  The Nokia needs an PC-card adapter and then
you put in a PC-card Bluetooth access card.  It is also GSM.  So the Moto is
the only useful one for me, except that I can't find one and I would have to
change providers as my current one is TDMA based.  I would thus need to
change numbers, foregoing one that I have had for just about 8 years now.
The alternative is to wait for a CDMA Bluetooth phone from someone.)

Earlier, Peter da Silva posted a very thoughtful comment about having MP3
devices on the Palm or using one as such.  He recounts an incident where
usage of the MP3 device drained the battery, leaving him with a hunk of
plastic at an inopportune time.

I was reading this past week, an article in PC Magazine about convergence.
This is where you could buy one handheld or pocketable device that would do
multiple things; in this instance, be a Pocket PC or organizer, be an MP3
player and be a digital camera.  The author stated that would be a bad thing
because if the camera broke, you would either have to get the whole thing
repaired, forego the use of the camera from then on, or replace the whole
thing.  I was thinking that even without breaking the unit, you would still
probably not want this device.  Technology developments come in cycles, and
each technology has a different cycle.  If you were to buy such a device and
it was the top end at that time, (which it would never be,) in a year,
certain functions would be so primitive compared to the then current state
of technology, you would probably stop using it.  Instead of just replacing
that one function, you would have to replace the whole thing.

Just after I sent this message, I was alerted to the following story:
http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1006-200-7528362.html?tag=dd.ne.dtx.nl-sty.0

In it your setup is discussed, along with its replacement.

Kind regards,

Denys. . .

Denys Beauchemin
HICOMP
(800) 323-8863  (281) 288-7438         Fax: (281) 288-7438
denys at hicomp.com                             www.hicomp.com

-----Original Message-----
From: HP-3000 Systems Discussion [mailto:[log in to unmask]]On Behalf Of
Dan Davis
Sent: Monday, October 15, 2001 10:16 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: OT: RE: PocketPC vs Handheld PC

Denys Beauchemin <[log in to unmask]> wrote in message
news:<[log in to unmask]>...

> So I went looking further on the Internet, between compiles and
> SQL pre-processings.
> In a few seconds, I came up with this:
> http://www.allnetdevices.com/wireless/news/2001/07/27/palm_loses.html
>
>
http://www.allnetdevices.com/industry/reality/2001/07/30/handheld_horse.html
>
> http://www4.gartner.com/5_about/press_room/pr20010726b.html
>
> These clippings definitely talk about number of units as market share
> measurements.  That is the way I understand these things, but perhaps
there
> are many people who understand market share to be total amount of revenue
by
> segments, (PalmOS, Pocket PC, Psion and others.)


There is still a big problem with the numbers.  They are pitting the
company Palm vs ALL Pocket PC manufacturers, as opposed to pitting ALL
PalmOS manufacturers vs ALL Pocket PC manufacturers.  Supposedly
Handspring alone now sells nearly as many PalmOS devices as Palm
itself does.

After doing quite a bit of research on Palm vs Pocket PC, I decided on
a Visor Prism.  $299 for 8meg + color display, plus a visor phone
which allows me to get cellular phone calls and get internet access at
9.6k (free when you buy a new visor and sign up for service).  In
addition I bought a GPS device ($142) and an MP3 player that has an
additional 64 meg on it, an additional memory slot free, and its own
batteries (~$150).

Total cost for GPS + Cell phone + wireless internet + MP3 player +
color organizer + 64 meg expansion : $620 (that includes the $20
startup fee for the phone / internet).

You cant even get close to that price with a PocketPC!  The best you
can do is get a Jornada 525, a 16 meg Pocket PC with serial synch
connection (my visor has USB) for $299.   Big problem with this and
other low end Pocket PC devices is that they cant run the new version
of Pocket PC 2002 - they dont use the new standard Intel ARM
processors, so you are guaranteed to have problems running new apps in
the near future.  Plus, you'll still have big problems coming anywhere
near the price point of the Handspring Visor with all those options.
Just getting cell phone + internet will add $300 to the Jornada, then
you still need to add a GPS (at least $150) and 64 meg for storage
($80).  Now you're talking ~$850 for a low-end PocketPC with similar
features as the Prism above, and that PocketPC is guaranteed not to be
able to to run new Pocket PC apps.  If you opt for a new ARM powered
PocketPC, you are talking another $200+ so ~$1050.
Thats like 70% more expensive!


-Dan

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