Michael asked a good question and John put his thoughts into his answer.  I
would like to present an alternative point of view.

I am still under the impression honesty and hard work count for a lot in
business and are the keys to success.  I refuse to automatically consider
anyone who succeeds in business to have done so by virtue of being a liar
and a cheat.  Rather, I believe this person's success is due to hard work
and a good work ethic and that is the way I live my life.

This belief of mine took a heavy hit during the 90's when we witnessed a
liar and a perjurer get away with everything and walk away from the White
House after 8 years with millions of dollars in their pockets.  I have had a
hard time explaining to my children this is not the proper way to success
and that these people will get theirs in due time.  The problem is they will
probably never get their just desserts in their lifetime.  What has happened
however is that by turning our eyes away from their misdeeds and either
excusing them or ignoring them, we as a society, have clearly stated that it
is now OK for anyone to do this.  We have said in effect, that it is
acceptable to do whatever you want; lie, cheat, steal and you can get away
with it, because other people do.   Even if you get caught, all you get is a
slap or censure.  At worse, you will go to execu-jail and play golf and
tennis for a few months. But even worse, we are now equating success with
lying and cheating and that is an insult to the majority of honest
successful people.

John talks about corporate greed and the size of the bonuses for people in
very high places.  I do not disagree and would also point out that we as a
society have created this.  Take the case of professional athletes, apart
from golfers, all of them are commanding incredible salaries win or lose.
(The reason I exclude golfers is very simple.  If they lose, they do not get
paid.)  Pop stars, movie stars, etc are now commanding vast amounts of
wealth for no other reason that people like to watch them act or hear them
sing.  While I am totally in favor of letting anyone earn as much as they
can, I am just amazed at how much money these people receive from their
adoring fans.

A few years ago in Houston, we had a vote to see if public funds could be
used to build a new stadium for the local teams.  I was totally against it.
Whilst I have no problem with people making money, I just can't see why
public funds have to be used to build a factory for someone so that his or
her employees (all millionaires, BTW) can work.  Let them build their own
factory.  The first vote was against, they came back a year later and this
time they got their factory built at the public's expense.  This type of
shenanigan is now acceptable in our society.

Anyway, I could go on for hours on this, and in the wake of April 15th, I
would also bemoan the present tax system which unduly punishes the people
who work hard, but we will let that go for now.
All this to say, that we have allowed it to happen and it is up to us to
reverse the trend.  If indeed laws were broken during the run up to the
vote, by all means punish the perpetrators, and not just with execu-jail
time either.  But if no laws were broken, give it up and let the folks get
to work.  There is a momentous task ahead.

Denys

-----Original Message-----
From: HP-3000 Systems Discussion [mailto:[log in to unmask]]On Behalf Of
John Lee
Sent: Friday, April 26, 2002 11:50 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: OT? [HP3000-L] NYTimes: Fiorina Scoffs at Accusation of
Coercion

At 12:18 PM 4/26/02 -0400, Michael Baier wrote:
>I don't want to put Ms. Fiorina in the same category but
>this all sounds like Kenneth Laye and Enron.
>I didn't know,....
>I didn't do....
>it was not meant ......
>I never thought.....
>
>Where is the "I say what I mean and how I mean it"?
>Where is the "This I said and I am responsible for the result"?
>Why is everybody afraid of critical unpleasent questions?
>Why does hardly anybody ask this questions?

Because we're obsessed with money and power.  Whoever has the most money
wins the game, no matter how they got it.  The end justifies the means.
That's why I say the biggest threat to our national security isn't outside
of our borders, it's within them.  We need the business Delta Force to go
inside the "corporate caves", one by one, and bring the white collar
criminals to justice, or as W says, "bring justice to them".  It's reaching
epidemic proportion...cheating has become OK...screwing your neighbor, or
friend, or employee, or vendor, is OK.  It's just part of doing business
and accumulating wealth.


John Lee
John Lee
HP Account Executive
Vaske Computer Solutions
Minneapolis, MN
952-844-0054

We sell, service, support and integrate HP 3000/9000 and related hardware,
new and old, since 1988

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