Hi Denys :)
Thank you for the good reply.
Also, thanks for the link to the board page for Interex (I had trouble
finding it off of www.interex.org when I went looking) and while not a
member myself... I do work for a member site... :)
Art "heading back to work now :) " Bahrs
----- Original Message -----
From: "Denys Beauchemin" <[log in to unmask]>
To: "'Art Bahrs'" <[log in to unmask]>; <[log in to unmask]>;
<[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2000 8:48 AM
Subject: RE: HP WORLD 2000: $20K to $25K for a speaker?!?!?!?!
> Art, to answer your questions directly: No, Greg's comments are his own,
they
> do not represent the opinions of Interex in any way.
>
> I apologize right up front for not speaking earlier or to even address all
your
> concerns completely in this message. As a member of the board of
directors, I
> am ethically and morally (and probably legally also) bound to not respond
> directly to each and every issue that comes up and are asked to be
answered.
> The board responds as a body only after due deliberation and therefore
does
> not move anywhere near Internet speed and especially not at HP3000-L
speed.
> The board may also elect to let someone from the Interex staff answer the
> questions or address the issues.
>
> Mr. Cagle elected to respond and says what he said of his own accord. As
I
> said, please do not transpose or attribute his thoughts to Interex or the
Board
> of Directors.
>
> I can assure you that the board and Interex is VERY aware of the various
issues
> raised in this, and other, forums (for a ?).
>
> If you go to: http://www.interex.org/inside/board.html, you will see that
you
> can send a message to the board directly at: [log in to unmask]
>
> The more information and opinions we have, the better the deliberations.
Also,
> if you send a message to the board, it might be a good thing to state
whether
> you are a member or not. As Interex is a member organization, the
opinions of
> members count far more than the opinions of non-members.
>
> Kind regards,
>
> Denys. . .
>
> Denys Beauchemin
> HICOMP
> (800) 323-8863 (281) 288-7438 Fax: (281) 355-6879
> denys at hicomp.com www.hicomp.com
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Art Bahrs [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2000 10:19 AM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: HP WORLD 2000: $20K to $25K for a speaker?!?!?!?!
>
> Hi Jeff :) & Greg & All Interex Board of Director Members
>
> Ok.. Greg used to be an employee of HP (working out of the Tigard, Or
> office) in the past I don't know if he is now or not....
>
> He was then, and appears now to think that the common user's were not
> able to grasp the big picture and therefore should be told what to do and
> think when it came to Interex's policies and procedures... We asked him
not
> to return.
>
> I also notice that Greg appears to be speaking on behalf of Interex, yet
> is not using an Interex tagline or domain name... Denys... Are these the
> opinions of Interex? or are they the opinions of someone who works for
> Interex ?
>
> Art "Offended by Greg Cagle and therefore by Interex!" Bahrs
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jeff Woods" <[log in to unmask]>
> To: <[log in to unmask]>
> Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2000 1:02 AM
> Subject: Re: [HP3000-L] HP WORLD 2000: $20K to $25K for a speaker?!?!?!?!
>
>
> > Hello, Mr. Cagle.
> >
> > You probably won't like what I have to say, but that's fine with me. I
> > didn't much like what you had to say either.
> >
> > On the other hand, I wish to apologize in advance to the teeming masses
> > that will receive this rant, but some of the ramifications of this
> > discussion impact everyone with an interest in MPE. Speaking out in
> > support of Stan's position is part of it, but I think the implications
> > regarding Interex and other things is significant enough to warrant
> > it. Just one man's opinion, but it's mine.
> >
> > At 09:55 PM 8/16/00, Greg Cagle replied to Stan's reply to Mr. Cagle's
> > reply to Stan's (appropriate, IMNSHO!) criticism:
> > >You forgot the IMHO in that paragraph.
> >
> > At best, he forgot "IMO". I'd almost be offended if Stan said "IMHO"
> > except I believe his humility exceeds his value. On the other hand, 'm
> > still wondering just who this Greg Cagle fellow is.
> >
> > > > > > Who's having a power-trip ("I/we must be important, we've got
> > > > > > a big name speaker)?
> >
> > I think perhaps you got your answer, Stan.
> >
> > > > > HP World is an industry-leading conference. This is par for the
> > > > > course. No power trip involved, just competitive reality. Perhaps
> > > > > you remember Scott Adams, one of our previous keynotes. Why don't
> > > > > you go check HIS rates and then get back to us.
> >
> > It would surely be wonderful if there were an USER'S group that cared
(at
> > all levels: I know there are a few Interex folks who do!) about one
> > particular "industry-leading" platform with a TLA (Three Letter Acronym)
> > name. I vaguely remember a truly useful user's group that took interst
in
> > MPE; as I recall, it was called HPIUG, Hewlett-Packard International
Users
> > Group. Don't know what happened to it, but seems to have been lost over
> > the years; a lot like my naivety.
> >
> > > > Uh, I realize you're somewhat of a newcomer to the HP 3000
> > > > community ... but I did complain about Scott Adams, too.
> > >
> > >I do not claim to be a member of the 3000 community. I am a member
> > >of the HP community, and of the Interex community.
> >
> > Noted. If you're fortunate, you'll correct that one of these days.
> >
> > > > I enjoy Adams' work, and was on his mailing list since the early
> > > > days. I've gone to free talks that he's done. But...that doesn't
> > > > mean that I did (or do) condone Interex paying him a lot of
> > > > money to speak to us!
> > >
> > >One person's opinion.
> >
> > One very well respected (for good reason!) person's opinion. BTW, Greg
> > (You don't mind if I call you Greg, do you?), who did you say you are
> again?
> >
> > > > > > Does Interex *really* think that hundreds of extra *paying*
> attendees
> > > > > > will show up because of him?
> > > > >
> > > > > No, no one is going to make a decision to attend based on the
> keynote
> > > > > alone. Nor are they going to make that decision based on the
party,
> > > > > or the lunches, or the material of the t-shirts. But if you miss
the
> > > > > mark on any one of those things (and thousands of others), the
> overall
> > > > > conference experience is less than it might have been, which
> translates
> > > > > directly to repeat business.
> >
> > Ah... that's right... I keep forgetting that Interex isn't really a
> group
> > of users or even a group providing services to a group of users.
IMNSHO,
> > it looks an awful (and I use that word very purposefully here) lot like
a
> > company that sells various services like computer conferences. BTW, is
> > Interex a non-profit entity or a for-profit one? I would have guessed
> it's
> > non-profit, but it sure seems to act an awful (There's that word again.)
> > like a for-profit enterprise to me these days.
> >
> > > > If you can't quantify it, then that leaves the question: why?
> > > > There are only a few possible reasons for spending $20K on a
speaker:
> > > >
> > > > 1) the speaker has a hold over you (I doubt this one)
> > > >
> > > > 2) you think it will increase the value of the conference for
> > > > the attendees *by an appropriate amount*. (I.e., add enough
> > > > value to justify the cost.)
> > > >
> > > > 3) you think it will increase sales of membership (again,
> > > > by at least an appropriate amount). (Or a combination of #2
and
> #3)
> > > >
> > > > 4) you get ego-boo from holding a conference with a "big name
> speaker".
> > >
> > >You apparently missed my point. I'm not going to restate it.
> >
> > Don't be too offended, Greg, but apparently you missed the point, not to
> > mention leaving out "IMHO". Of course, you are quite welcome to your
> > opinions even when they are wrong.
> >
> > "What are the facts? Again and again and again -- what are the facts?
Shun
> > wishful thinking, ignore divine revelation, forget what "the stars
> > foretell," avoid opinion, care not what the neighbors think, never mind
> the
> > unguessable "verdict of history" -- what are the facts, and to how many
> > decimal places? You pilot always into an unknown future; facts are your
> > single clue. Get the facts!" -- from "The Notebooks of Lazarus Long" by
> > Robert Anson Heinlein
> >
> > >Stan, with all due respect, Interex is a multimillion dollar business.
> > >I suggest you leave the management of it to the people the Board
> > >has hired to do it and quit trying to micromanage something you
> > >clearly don't understand.
> >
> > Greg, with all due respect (and I realize that hasn't been overflowing
in
> > this particular document), Interex ought to do so what it's membership
> > expects it to do. And somehow I think Stan still counts as one of
> > those. Apparently that won't be true this time next year and that's a
> huge
> > loss for that portion of Interex and it's members with an interest in
> > things related to MPE and the HP[e]3000. On the other hand, I'm sure
that
> > if you were to decide not to renew your membership when it expires that
> the
> > multimillion dollar business known as Interex will be disappointed.
> >
> > "All men are created unequal." -- RAH (same as above)
> >
> > P.S. One of the things I've learned is that strong words shouldn't be
> said
> > rashly. The hours I spent between beginning this reply and editing it
> took
> > much of the edge off my words, but please don't think my mild response
> > means I don't have much of an opinion on it. :)
> >
> > --
> > Jeff Woods
> >
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> > Do You Yahoo!?
> > Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger.
> > http://im.yahoo.com
>
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