In message <[log in to unmask]>, Roy Brown 
<[log in to unmask]> writes
>
>Anyway, I have another cunning plan, if you could bear to check this 
>out for me, much of which is covered by the groundwork you've laid 
>above.
>
>Basically, it's to do the same, but with MS Access, and import your 
>test database into that, with the same ODBC driver, or better, your 
>Image/Allbase one, if it will allow that.
>
>If it does the import, then Database Tools/Relationships should give 
>exactly the diagram that Connie needs.
>
>The only(!) downside to this method is that it will import all the data 
>from the database, not just the schema, so it probably needs to be done 
>with small or empty databases. But if it works, I'm sure Connie could 
>use test databases, or even generate some new empty bases from her 
>schemata to use.

Ok we will try the extra mile :-)

I can find no way to import and at the same time create a database from 
an odbc source in Access. I may be thick but access will let me open a 
database of a type it recognises and convert it to access database. Or 
it will allow me to create an access database define the tables and then 
import data. The latter we obviously don't want to do as the whole 
exercise it to have that extracted for us automagically. The former as 
far as I can see access has no mechanism to import an undefined database 
via odbc.

I thought I'd have a further play with visio, and found that I could 
select the driver (for this test I used ODBC/Link/SE from MBFoster. So 
if you had any of the IMAGE/SQL/Allbase aware drivers you can use them. 
However I found the end result no different than using the Generic ODBC 
driver from the previous test.

However looking at the results I have the following conclusions, which 
I'd be happy to have someone jump on if I'm incorrect. Also I don't know 
what the Full MBF or Minisoft ODBC Drivers can do, or if they can 
directly access a Turboimage database without going via the IMAGE/SQL 
definition.

The only databases and tables that I could access are those set up in 
the SQL DBE definition. So if you haven’t gone through all that work 
in the first place then its a non starter. As far as I can see the DBE 
only contains information about the datasets that someone has chosen to 
add (or probably that is make available via a VIEW). If when adding the 
database(s) datasets to the DBE if only the default item mappings were 
used then all you are going to find out is that an item is char or 
numeric, but you would have no idea about "date" types or decimal places 
etc. So again not much good if your trying to provide a data structure 
description.

Anyway taking a reasonably well formed database into visio and reverse 
engineering, you do get the tables and items. It will show you what the 
indexes in the tables are but as far as I can see it doesn't show that a 
detail is linked to a particular master. Automasters are missing anyway 
as they are really only for Image.

My conclusion would be that if you have done all the work to load the 
databases in the SQL/DBE and done all the data type mappings then 
importing in visio might be a reasonable start to documenting the 
databases, as all you would have to do is add the linkages between the 
sets.

If you don't have everything in the SQl/DBE then I would say we are back 
where we started.

Go into QUERY open the database just do an "FO" it will tell you 
everything about all items, all datasets, all indexes, paths etc. Do a 
select all, Copy, go into word and paste. Then if you want to be really 
helpful go through the item defs and make up if they are a date format, 
of if numeric how many implied decimals. Oh and if your using a char as 
a numeric, or you have a field overloaded with undescribed children, 
that is probably the most useful info.

And I'd probably go back to my original point, which is if they can't 
work from that, you could probably spend a week in visio on each 
database and still not be able to give them anything more useful.






-- 
Alan Yeo
[log in to unmask]    Just because you're paranoid
Phone +44 1684 291710   it doesn't mean someone isn't!.
Fax   +44 1684 291712

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